element109 (Stranger)
05-29-00 11:58
No 10656
      Yes, i believe in MDP2Pol  Bookmark   

Who or where does it says that only the P1Pol is created ? I beginning to believe dr Strangelove when he said it works but is obfiscated by people wanting to keep it secret.

1: allylbenzene + H2SO4 --> P2Pol
2: Or chem_wannabee, tBOC and the others are pathetic liars or narcs, which sounds very unlikely to me, or they have made honey this way.
3: Iudexk had some, although it was little,

MDP2Pol must exist, that's for sure.

More coming later...

05-30-00 18:07
No 11334
      Re: Yes, i believe in MDP2Pol  Bookmark   

I think that that someone was Chemhack, who reported what looked like a metabisulfite addition product of maybe-MDP2P.

I've read the Batman story yesterday, nice idea to obtain the 2-ol from the haloalkane, especially when the problem is in the H2SO4 addition.

Maybe 50% would work better? I think this would reduce the chance of polymerization.

SWIM is going to try this and K2Cr2O7/AcOH.

What about dipping a 300C hot sheet of cupper into MDP2Pol ? In theory it would oxidize perfectly ;)

05-31-00 15:53
No 11747
      Re: Yes, i believe in MDP2Pol  Bookmark   

i have said this one numerous times, vogels exp for oxidising NONPOLAR SECONDARY alcohols to ketones.

You make ur alcohol and extract it immediately with ether. The ether soln is then reacted at room temp with good stirring for 2hrs (quite a lot he did) and u form a ketone with NO SIDE REACTIONS.
apparently the pol sits in the insoluble ether layer. The chromic acid forms a soluble ester which brings it into the aquesous layer, this hydrolyses or something, bammo a ketone is formed and it goes str8 back into the ether layer, not subjected to anymore acid, oxidising agents etc.

The only prob is making the 2POl, i think its quite difficult. but if u do make it look at this method:
1. Ether extraction of alcohol, no boilng increasing temps to get 2Pol out
2. Rm temp oxidation and quite short
3. apparently no side rxns.

his example was octan-2-ol to octan-2-one

06-05-00 21:17
No 14021
      Re: Yes, i believe in MDP2Pol  Bookmark   

Ok, i'm gonna pull a gyro here, someone write it up and we'll see if the elves are willing to try it out.  SWIM got something once that smelled like MDP2P, but the amination failed(not from lack of ketone, but from other problem). 

06-06-00 12:19
No 14364
      Re: Yes, i believe in MDP2Pol  Bookmark   

That's the ol' spirit !!

The guy 'SWIM' who comes in my dreams time-by-time lives in on another but very similar planet, where there are no laws on chemistry!
He's going to experiment again with the p2pol route.

1: safrole > MDP2Pol: maybe use 50% H2SO4? Keep everything very cold, at any moment, and don't heat it !

2: then IMMEDIATELY extract with Et2O and use this IMMEDIATELY with aq. acidic K2Cr2O7 a la Biscuit above.

3: when ketone is formed, purification with bisulfite or NaI ?
I don't suppose you can use the unclean oil directly in the AlHg reduction.

06-25-00 09:42
No 21179
      Re: Yes, i believe in MDP2Pol  Bookmark   

Honestly check out this exp in Vogel, 5th edition. Any exp that is written out at verbatim, from perhaps the most credible source, which is useful here, should be looked at very closely.
It is beyond simple; provided u have the 2Pol, as i said getting that seems to be the prob, most H20/H2So4 methods i have seen seem to require heat.